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Episode 89 · 7 months ago

EVERYTHING, EVERYWHERE, ALL AT ONCE (2022) Interview with Cinematographer Larkin Seiple

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Parth and Trent discuss Everything, Everywhere, All At Once with its cinematographer Larkin Seiple. They also discuss why Trent fell asleep during the film.

We are tonight's entertainment. You can't handle the true the fire risals pizza time. You're a wizard, Harry, so we you know you think that's are. You're breathing proovy. I don't have friends. I strew the suits. So part what have you been eating? You're looking well, by the way, tread, nice to see you. Weave a podcast, we do. I had gum me vitamin vitamin D me, exactly the one that the sun provides. Yeah, I have a whole. Couldn't just go outside, bro well, these are a holdover from the winter time, when we would mostly be inside, and my brown Indian complexion requires that I have more vitamin D. No, that I white counterparts. Yes, the last time I went to the doctor they were like you should start taking vitamin D pills because, like everyone has seasonal depression and it's pretty much just because no one gets enough vitamin D, and I was like, Oh, never put that together. Yeah, what have you been having? I'm slipping on some cranberry juice. Here I have adult, adult multivitamins sitting bedside, but I don't really take him that much, I think. Despite my parents best efforts, should I do you feel like healthier. Should we have one on air? Sure, sure, why not? Wait, I'll have it. I'll have one too. I think the recommended dope is too so I'm just going to go for it. Wow, they're all like stuck together and like one mega ball and I had to like pry off. I really love when that happens. Yep, I'm going in. Are they so? Is this the first time we've eaten on the POD? I feel like one time I made you eat on Pod, or maybe I was eating something, but this is definitely lost like chewing. We've dumb. Yeah, this is not a regular occurrence. Well, that's done. Yeah, well, I feel better already. I've got a pepper my step now. I was depressed before and now I feel a little bit less depressed. Yeah, the suns like, I don't know this what a nice stay out. You know this? Have a new out I have a new outlook on life. But, Trent, we have a pretty awesome interview. Yeah, and we have a movie to talk about. It's maybe we should cut to the INTRO. Wait, what movie? Are we doing? Everything everywhere all at once? Yeah, yeah, we are. It's a new it's a new movie. People like it. We like it. Trent fell asleep during the movie. Will get to that, but let's cut to the intro Q. The intro. Welcome back to craft services, where we talk about the movies each week. We talked about a film and hopefully have a crew member of that phone to talk with us about their experience working on the picture. This week, would we have Trent? We interview Larkinciple, the cinematographer of such films as I don't feel at home in this world anymore. Swiss army man and our movie for this week everything everywhere, all at once. It was a really great interview, I think. Do you think so? I think so too. It was a really great interview for a really great movie, which Trent saw. Forty percent of Trent speak on that. Okay, so we have to go back a little bit. Only forty percent, you think, oh, it's sorry, sorry. Sixty percent, you told I've forty percent. Yeah, I've, I've was missing. Forty percent. Yeah, Miss I've got that job bad. I've got the General Justis, but the Second Act I was unconscious for, and here's why. So we have to go back to a shoot that you are a...

...part of, also to a colleague named George who did a medieval movie, and feel free to chime in whenever you're ready. But there was a chest prop that was like wooden, but it then it was like coated and steel or something, and so it was very, very heavy and the castle location was like a forty five minute hike, like on foot up this mountain with a fair out, without the chest. Yeah, without the chest, and and quite there's a lot of terrain and you actually have to like climb. The trail that we would normally have to have gone on was all I see and dangerous to go on. I was in sneakers because I didn't have the right shoes. That's just a fun little detail for you guys. And because of that, while we were going up, we couldn't use the correct trail. So we have to go in the middle of the actual woods to get the chest up, because there were leaves on the ground there, which made it a little bit easier for us to carry stuff onto. But the other problem was that there were rocks on there, like large rocks, which made it very difficult to transport. And so a journey that our director is anticipating would take twenty five minutes took two hours. To get it from bottom to top. So in the end we the chest eventually arrived a lot behind schedule. We filmed the necessary scenes and I believe the original plan was that we would take the chest down with us and ever get up, back up the next day and then bring it back up with us the next day. And we quickly learned that that would be impossible, or like possible, but no one would be not something we were going to do as not for free, as unpaid people. Yeah, and so I talked to the director and I was like you need to sacrifice the chest and leave this here forever, because even at the end of the shoe, no way you can convince them to take it down. This down to be worse than up, I think. And it was still, I see, and snowy and a dress. We're like we barely got through up without someone getting hurts, like no way, we're getting down. Yeah, and so he said fine, let's leave the chest in one of like the castle buildings and we rap shooting and then like two months pass and it's last week and George was like, let's go back to the castle. I need like one pickup shot and I don't have enough coverage of the chest opening, and so I'm just going to do like an evil, dead ground shot steadicam, approaching the chest as it opens. And we were like okay, fine. So we drove an hour and then heikes forty five minutes to get to the castle and then we got there and the chest was gone and somebody either stole it or, like the park security, probably threw it away or some jet. Jackson Clark recommended that. The reason we're telling this story is because when we went back in, the chest was gone. This was the day I went to see everything everywhere all at once, and it'll it will tie back in. But Jackson thought that if he had been a part of this, he would have thrown it off the ledge, and so we checked around all the ledges for a while and it wasn't there. So we thought that park security may have taken it. But then we came back from that that and I was like, parth, I'm too tired to go see the movie, and Jackson was like, I wanted to go see the movie too, but I was the missing link because I needed to drive all of us. And then I thought I'm one hundred pcent on a fall asleep during the movie, but to save my friendship with these two people, I need to sacrifice like the twelve dollars for the movie ticket and just take an expensive nap and then have to go back and see the movie a second time before the discussion, which, tier credit, you did do, but we needed to because we had to interview with the guy on Saturday...

...and any other day of the week was going to be rough. Yes, but you saw the entire day of the film. I saw the entire day of the film, so you could speak on right now if you had to, if I had to. But why should I speak on it when we can have our guest speak on it right now, larkinciple, the DP of the project. Should we just get into it? Pretty cool. Yeah, let's let's cut to that. Q The interview. Hello, everybody, and welcome to our interview with larkinsiple. He's the cinematographer that's worked on such films as COP car. I don't feel at home in this world anymore. So sorry, man, and our film for today everything everywhere all at once. Thank you so much for being with us today. Yeah, thanks for having me. So just to start off, how do you first get involved in filmmaking? And why'd you go down the path of cinematography? Do you want the long story, you want the short story? The medium? All right, I think I got in the filmmaking in a very like American way and that movies, especially these, were kind of coveted and blockbuster was a thing and it was a big deal to go out and see a movie rent one, and the rating system made a lot of movies kind of off the table, like our rated films and etc. And at Summer Camp I think we watched a movie called sixteen candles, which had like violence and cursing and nudity, and I was shocked. Think it was eight and I found out the movie was right PG. So then I was like was like realized. I was like, Oh, this this loophole, like a lot of s films are basically like soft r rated films with a different rating. So I then spent like the next like two or three years just running like every storm I could get my hands on and attempt to like see something, you know, forms exactly, or something my parents wouldn't let me see, and I kind of just started getting in the films that way and then eventually I just and weekends I have to go up my mom to her work and I would just kind of wander a multiplex, you know, like by like one ticket and see six movies, just kind of hopping theater to theater. Yeah, I did that and then I was like, you know, college came around was like, I guess I like movies. I started making them in school, but I wasn't like, you know, some of these guys out there that were just like making epic films of their friends and shooting on sixteen mill and high school and doing all sorts of crazy stuff. So I just went to a film school in Boston and they're I start working on a lot of film sets and quickly realized that I didn't really want to direct because I thought it really painful that the director would work on one project a year and if I could do something else, like a cinematographer, I could have, you know, a huge collaborative part in many projects within the course of one year, and so I kind of got into the photography side of filmmaking and Heaven look back. So how did you first meet the Daniels? I'm knew Daniels Shiner in College. He was in one of my roommates comedy troops. It was very funny guy and we hung up parties and things like that. And then later in Los Angeles, when I was in the early music video scene for all a lot of these emerson kids, I met them at an event called video mocker where a bunch of like young directors would screen movie or screen music videos. And the Daniel showed up and they showed this music video that they had shot in their d with their friends and they screened along, you know, some other movies that actually are not in movies, but other music videos. I had actual budgets and like known artists and things like that, and their video kind of blew everyone away just in terms of like sheer joy and creativity. And it was done for like a hundred dollars with the camera that everyone owned, but it was just so kind of wonderful. I remember very this is, you know, early twenty is very drunkenly at the party, just like like, you know, kind of Gob smacked and just like singing...

...their praises and talking about how everyone else was trash and they didn't need money. And I remember I embarrass myself quite a lot, but I kind of kind of you know, connected back with them and said I'll anything you guys shoot. I want to shoot it, and then they kind of put me to the test. We shot a bunch of short films like pocket such, I'm not sure if anyone else here is seen, and a bunch of smaller music videos in a very quick and fast manner and just started kind of steam rolling from there until we made Swissy awesome. So, like, what are they like to work with? Obviously everything with two directors. So, but their one unit, I guess. So what's is there a process? How was that power at divided? It's I don't know, it's I don't know. It's like a Hydra, you know you's too headed, but it's still one beast. They mean they're really fun to work with. Is a thing. We generally have fun. There used to be a thing called Daniels pitch where they would almost like, you know that for music videos least, to turn the song on and like kind of like get warmed up and that this whole routine where they would just talk you through the song as it was happening. But if you watch any of their music videos it's kind of surreal to watch because their whole like the Daniels gag or like their thing is as much story as possible in a small amount of time. Like that's been their concept from the very beginning. So you just kind of watch these two knuckleheads just like absurd they try to pitch you a story and convey the emotions and what the cameras doing at the same time in the course of two or three minutes. That's what it's kind of been like, and they've always left it really collaborative, like they're when working with them. Their ideas are so absurd or ridiculous and what makes them beautiful is just like if we can get people to believe that these are real or to like fall for them, if that makes sense, to like actually like care about what's happening to a corpse that has a boner for a compass like that would be amazing. And so my job generally was to try to make their ideas feel less stupid with photography, you know, try to make them feel beautiful or real or serene, or try to find a way to let the audience say it's okay, to say yes, if you will, to like kind of fall in to whatever crazy story they're making. And it hasn't really stopped since it's been like that on every project is just trying to to add elegance to something that isn't. It is the polar opposite of that and that's what they usually ask of me and they and they're looking for like how do we again make something like Swissy doesn't have any right to be as pretty as it was? And you know, we spent a long time location scouting for them most beautiful forest we could find in the west coast. We actually spend like a whole week driving up the coast of California to find a place where had a cave and to find a place to have him discover the boner compass and all these absurd, you know, plot points and where we could do it. And we found I think there's a called a place called avenue of the giants in northern California. That's just kind of stunning. It feels like a church. That's how like kind of like mat magnificent it is. But yeah, I know it's just kind of just, you know, pushing the limit on how much you can care about something so silly. Before we get too distracted with the major motion pictures you've worked on, I have a little bit of a nonsequitter and you mentioned your music videos and I saw in your IMDB that you were the DP for Childish Gambino on this is America and sweatpants, and I was wondering how your amateur music video career turned into that, because those are both like very famous, very good music videos that I've seen before as a person who doesn't watch music videos. Well, at the same time that I was working with Daniels as they were coming up, I was also working with Puromai, who is a music video director and is director of a lot of the episodes of Atlanta and a producer on it. So we were kind of cutting our teeth at the same time and it was it was very fun to kind of jump back and forth between Daniels and heroes, which are very different projects, but both kind of expect a lot visually. Yeah, that's all I got. I mean,...

...yeah, I just kind of started with here at the very beginning. I think I started working with him before, before Daniels. I can't quite remember it. It's kind of blurry. There was a ton of us all around the age of like twenty three or twenty four that just get dropped into Los Angeles and we're all kind of hanging out in this early music video scene, which is kind of great. We used to have Christmas parties every year for Jams Day and would be like thirty directors and like cinematographers and production designers and costomers. It was really kind of a kind of close community at the very beginning because we're all just trying to figure out what the Hell is going on. But I met a lot of people through that and then met hero that way too. But yeah, I know it's funny to do like say, turned down for what with the Daniels, and then do this as America and have them explode for completely different reasons. A lot of it's just luck, to be honest, just that you happen to have, you know, work of the right director, if the right song. So getting into our main topic of the day, how do you get in? Well, we worked on Swiss army man, so I'm assuming that was your way into everything, everywhere all at once. Yeah, it was. Yeah, they've been talking about it for a long time, you know. They think originally was called bubbles, the idea of all these bubbles connected or bubble theory. I tried to convince them the change it to everything everywhere every time, so I could call it ethree to make it easier to say they weren't. They were, they were not having it. To three. Yeah, exactly. I was really pushing that. Just like Swiss army man, we call Swiss a we wanted. I wanted to go one of a nice little shorthand do you have a shorthand for the new movie? Is it just everything everywhere once all it's Eaoh and I just call it Yoh now, which is makes no sense. It's just everyone knows what I'm talking about when I say it. But no, I we keep looking for a shorthand for it and it's just one of those films that you just did never gets there. But yeah, they've been talking about it for a long time and they would. We're kind of teasing like a lot of the fun little pieces to it, like universe jumping and how that made sense and like the different worlds we can do and we had already played with flashbacks and I got really excited about it because, again, the Daniels thing is how much story can you jam into the shortest amount of time? Is a big part of besides the film, everything everywhere. All I wants, besides it having a lot to happen in it. All the flashbacks, it's like you're watching literally someone's life happened in twenty seconds, and that felt really exciting to like put all this weight on to like five images and like how it's the most blunt way we can make sure that the audience understands what's happening. But it all kind of like the original one from Michelle is it stems from her running down an alleyway. I'm not sure if all three versions happened, but the first one is she runs and her father yells at her, then she leaves women and there's one version where she's running and she trips and she lands on sticks and she's blinded and she becomes an opera singer. But it was those little, those little tiny moments that they kept kind of teasing out and they actually held back from the full scope of the narrative story until until they found like a happy place for it. I always knew was about a family trying to come together, but I just kind of learned the details slowly and the first time I read the script I think I like burned through it just because it was kind of wanted to know where it was going, like it was such a crazy script. I was like what is where this is all going to end up? And then the second time I read it through, trying to figure out how many different things we had to shoot, and I just stopped counting at one point. I was just like, I guess we'll just figure this out as we go because I can't even keep track. So, with that being said, like it's takes place like throughout the cosmos, but also it's just like in one building, and so I feel like in that sense, it like how'd you approach it to make like the one building look different? And also I am sure there's a lot of like green screens involved. There's very little green screen. The only time we really use green screen was when they were directly in front of the Bagel top of the staircase, and then every other time we actually got...

...an inflatable Bagel, which is just like a giant platable inner tube we just kind of put up there as reference. But for the most part there's little, there's there's only like there's a sequence where they're fighting and every hit they go through is is a different universe. So we had to build a lighting and to ask how you did that. We found all the stock footage and then we built, basically we had to build a lighting set up for every twelve frames and we timed it and we built it on the a click track, so the actors would land in the lighting would switch till like a sunset, to a house on fire to the lit by sparklers, which was a really huge pan ass to try to figure out what does it look like to be surrounded by a bunch of sparklers? And that was all on green screen. The annoying a part about that was we shot that with Joe Bu in the shells double because it was after during the pandemic, and then this really elaborate lighting system that we built that looks very silly. We then had to basically do a diagram of it and take photos and then there as a team in Paris had to recreate it. was where Michelle was. So we had to bring Michelle in for basically ten hours of reshoots because she couldn't get back to the US, or not reshoots, but pick up sort of things that we couldn't finish on them film, and they had to then recreate it on a stage. There luckily I had a friend in Konama who's a cinematographer there. It is like a wonderful job and you can't even tell the work he did. That's how seamless his talent is. But that was that was a fun zoom from midnight till at M in Los Angeles. Well, they worked at the proper time and in Paris. But the building, the building. We actively tried to do the diehard approach and how can we make one building compelling? So we started out in this big atrium, massive cubicles and plate of scale, and then after that we started working into like smaller cubical spaces that were window based, and then we went into like hallways where the lights are turned off and it's just security lighting or production. Designer also started pushing the idea that the building was under construction from the very beginning. It's kind of subtle, but as you're making your way through what you're seeing people working on it, and so later on, as they get towards the end, you know there's like a there's the the butt plug fight is actually in a construction area. Because we were so tired of shooting cubicles with what if we just covered the cubicles and like, you know, tarps and putting construction lighting and things like that, and then we shifted actually ends back where it started, which is the atrium. So we go back to the ground floor and have a dusk feeling. And then the very end, which is what we call the empathy fight, where she makes your way up the stairs, kind of using kindness to stop people the lightning that, for their actually makes no sense. It's this big giant golden soft box that's kind of vibrating with like this kind of chaos. I guess it's the Bagel Light, if you will, this big pulsing top light that's happening. That's basically what we did. We did actively try to find different looks into to switch it up for every scene because we thought I've seen movies that are all set in an office space and that's kind of soft overhead lighting gets pretty monotonous after a while. So, in terms of how you shot the film, Did you shoot on film or digital, because I'm pretty sure you shot on film. You've shot on film for other projects and like what your preference is or if it's just depending on the project. This one was all digital. We wanted to shoot film for the flashbacks and for the rock sequence. We thought it'd be really funny if we shot the rocks on Imax and like, we didn't. We didn't. We really wanted to, because I was like, guys, what if, what if they do play this in Imax? How like mind blowing would it be for that for the audience to be in there and see this little indie then all of a sudden the full screen is filled with rocks? We ultimately didn't do it because we were when we shot the rocks, or did with a crew of like five people, super scrappy, middle of pandemic cars, getting stuck in a middle a desert that was four hours away from Los Angeles. But originally the plan was there for it. But by the time you get to that point, you know production is not excited to spend money...

...on Imax film when they'd rather, you know, have, you know, better wardrobe or, you know, more lights to pull off the action sequences and things like that. But in general, when it comes to shooting film and digital, I think the product, not the product, but the projects kind of call for it themselves. This one had a lot of in camera effects and speed ramping and high speed and just visual effects in general, just for the workflow and digital made sense and I think the Daniels like the immediacy of digital. They like to see what they're working with. And we also had so many different looks that we were able to build a lot of the the lets in advance so we could kind of figure out, like you know, we could actually light the scenes of knowing how it was going to look in camera. But the film I did right after, called to Leslie, was like a Smuch, even smaller indie. We shall that on thirty five because we knew it was going to be scrappy and we wanted to kind of embrace the flaws and I think film is wonderful at making flaws look elegant and natural and making them not really look like flaws. And that's usually the reason why I've tend to shoot on the film is there's a real beauty to it. When it's unlet. It feels much more real, whereas digital unlet can can look real crap real quick. So what kind of Lens Stain? I was just going to ask what kind of Lens is you were shooting on, but it seems like parts is going to ask and what you're like go to lens measurement is does in general, the so there's a lot of universes. So there's the what we'll call the the action verse or the Main Universe. That does become the action universe. WAS ON Z I super speeds, which is, you know, the Lens that I kind of, I think everyone theoretically comes up working with and that it's the fast lends that can open to a one hundred and three. It's sharp but not too sharp, and I kind of fell out of love with it, like you know, a couple of years after college, because that's all shot. It on all I shot with then. Lately it's the only ones I really want to shoot with and that it's again sharp but not too sharp, as well as focus as well, doesn't distort too much. But we shot, we shot that Lens for the you know, the whole opening fifteen minutes and everything into the IRS building and then once, once Waymond eats the chapstick and channels his fanny pack fighter mode, we switch to animorphictors, like the camera like is above him and pulls back and that spherical. But you can fill the bar start to slowly drift in and then the rest of the sequence is all done on Hawk Anamorphix. Took again to kind of give it a little larger than life feeling, kind of like what they did of die hard, which is a movie that shot an animorphic. That doesn't seem like it should be given all the tight spaces and low light requirements, but it looks awesome and so we kind of wanted to embrace that esthetic for the whole action sequence. And then the you know, it kind of fluctuates between different places. I think hot dog hands was shot on Super Ball tars to give it a softness in the romanticism. We shot in Cannon Cave thirty five for the one car Wi verse, because when get wide open they have like a really beautiful Boca. Then we knew we were going to be playing really shallow because we had to dress an alleyway and downtown La to feel like it was Hong Kong. The two thousand and one monkey scene was shot on old animorphix called toadeyos to try to make it feel like they were flawed and the image felt a little more filmic. You know that we had a whole new universe we cut called a noodle verse, which was shot on the problens about a baby, about a baby macaroni that was stuck in the pot of Pasta, and Evelyn, like even Evelyn, threads the macaroni and pulls it to the surface to save it. We spent two days shooting pasta with animate with like Pupa, like pot, like puppet pasta. I'm pretty sure that I'll be on the bets, but it was. It was like potentially too far for the film to go. Racca Cunei was originally going to be an Ode to like early PTA movies, like punch, drunk, love and Magnolia. We shot it a morphic and we embrace like the strong color themes of like red and blue and white, and then...

...we could ultimately light it the way that they had lit magnolia and etc. Like we are excited to do, like a big running sequence at the end, similar to how they drop the frogs. But we we spent all the money on just getting the stunt the stunts, the stunt actors, on a wireless on a rig so they could actually run, and had nothing left to light it, so that whole scene ended up just being lit with the practicals that were there, as opposed to like a big bright backlight slamming down on the street, but it was small things and and a lot of a lot of the lensing and looks weren't you know, they started out as I could be cool if it look like that movie, but then when we reference them, that didn't look how we remembered them. That makes sense, like our memories were much more romantic about how the film's looked and felt and we ended up kind of veering away from the references a lot. It was like that's where it started, but then we kind of pushed it and there is a reason we pushed it to was, you know, there's there's a lot of universes in this film and the Daniels really wanted to make sure it was clear what universe you were in. So they, you know, they went bigger on the wardrobe, we went bigger on the colors and the lighting so that when you clicked between universes there wasn't confusion. You're like, okay, this is where I am, this is where I am. That was part of the reason for why it looks though that way. I'm glad you brought up the long car ve verse, because that was going to be one of my questions because I was like Kay, who a quon had while I was watching, I was like this is like Tony Leong, like this looks like that, and I was gonna ask about that scene, like the conversation where he's talking about like being nice, as how he fired, being kind, as how he fights. Like what was it like shooting that scene, just because that was that's one of my favorites in the entire movie. Um, well, that whole sequence with him was really magical because, you know, key, we've been working, we've been work, we've been working with him the whole film and he's closer to his normal character than he is to those other characters in a way. And I was I was remember being a little skittish when Daniels were like, Hey, we have the actor from date, from Indiana, Jo owns and Gooney. He's going to play the lead, as like, Oh my God, that's excited. Canny still act, and watching him play Waymond and being this very like Beta character and then watching him like kind of pull it out and be like a character from a one car wi film. This like very smooth, honest like Debonair, was pretty magical to watch. And the first time we we did a what's called step printing, which is basically just you know, you you do a low frame rate and the camera moves in the world starts to blur and you do that in camera, but if you play it back at twenty four it looks like high speed. So you have to basically add a frame to each of it to get that blurriness. And the first time we did that of him on top of the stairs looking down at Evelyn, everyone was like, Oh shit, like he's gonna do it. And then when we did the the alleyway scene, was the last thing we shot, or was on the very last day of filmmaking, and it was actually raining at the end of it and we this is an alleyway that was behind the theater they were in and watching. The first time we did it we weren't really sure how key was going to play it and he just turned it on like he doesn't smoke cigarettes, that he boom. You know, you wouldn't you couldn't tell it was. I mean that whole scene we were just kind of standing back at all we had. I think we were going to do more complicated camera moves on it at one point and we just saw the performance and we're like let's just let him do it, like just you don't need to do anything, just let's just watch. And that's the one time in the film I think we shortsighted things where we put the actors on the hard left of their eyeline to kind of force the audience to pay attention to what's happening to them. I don't think we do anywhere else in the film. It was awesome and I took noticeably great. That's sort of leads our next question. So we're things like malleable on set in terms of like the performance or like the camera moves per se, or were things like storyboarded very heavily? There was not one storyboard and this whole film we're there's lists. Yes, they were made in the car on...

...the way to set. Generally, that's not true. That's not true. We walked through a lot of the scenes in advance and I think the key to to making good indies, anything, making good anything it is, is really when you location scout it, like really walking through and knowing you know how you're going to shoot it and why you're going to shoot it that way and you know that the one car wise sequence was a little spooky and I we you know, we scouted this alley way during the day. It's just like this boring, dirty alley. Why there's nothing elegant to it. Another production was on the other side of the fence and they're like, Oh shit, how are we going to put tarp over the fence? How are we going to hide all these trucks? But covid it happens. When we shot there on the day they had been cleared out. But we knew that. We like the idea of short sighting them and looking down the alley real like. COBLE will embrace that. But a lot of the other scenes, you know, the Daniels had very specific like just the first scene where they're meeting with gear dribro BER DRA and doing their taxes and Evelyn is in two different universes talking and having to like Pan left and right and then talk to like, you know, dear Jo on one universe and then Waymond in the other. They had all that figured out. But I guess the idea was that when we scouted these places we use them as muses and it wasn't like like the locations on the script were very open and so when we we know when we found this alleyway we had, we you know, we adjusted it because it was like, oh, that's a te like we weren't planning on that. So we'll have them linger inside that Little Cove and then a lot of the office space scenes will like, well, what if we just moved it down here? So it was it was pretty malleable. The fight sequences are all previoused, which is much harder than storyboarding, and that we you know that Daniels worked with the Lee brothers really found on Youtube and they designed fight sequences of the them and then their team, Marshall Club, but actually go and shoot out these crazy fight sequences and the Daniels would ask for a two minute fight and we'd get back like a seven minute fully choreograph fight that was cut together and then pair it down. And then once we had done that, we would then go to location figure out what parts of that could we take and use and how to how to utilize it, because a lot of that, a lot of the fighting is choreographed around the camera. That isn't like it's a lot of like very ridiculous shots of like you know, of Danny Pack hitting a guy in the face and his head knocks back and hit someone else who hit someone else. Like a lot of it was previous, which is the only way those fights could have happened. So even though we didn't do storyboarding, I think prevision is a lot more time and energy in but it was mainly just for the fights that gives me so much anxiety. We also we also we also, it was forty five minutes away from Los Angeles to get to Simi Valley where we shot it, and I kind of treated it like a location film. So I drove to Dan Quan's house every morning and then me, Quan Shiner, and then Jonathan Wong, our producer, gotten a van that the Daniels assistant drove and so we'd spend forty five minutes kind of prepping on the way to set, talking about what was coming up and how we were going to do it, and then forty five minutes on the way back from set kind of downloading and talking about the next day. And having that hour and a half every day with them was really helpful, and Nob did the same thing on Swiss army man, but just trying to like being able to talk to someone about the day's work in a low stake situation is important because as soon as they get out of that car there's like, you know, six departments all have questions for them, actors all have questions for them, and so being able to actually, you know, talk to them about what we're going to do and have a kind of a creative space where things could change really helped. So I was you spoken about the aspect ratio changing. was how early on in the process? Was that integrated? They I had always I'd wanted to do it in camera aspect ratio change before. I'd seen it done before really well, bizarrely, I think...

...in the hunger games sequel. Oh yeah, it isn't that when they go up into the hunk game. Yeah, it's. It's next. It's so well done. As much as you don't like pop movies, pariances as Lawrence is like a brilliant director. And like I forget. She's in the elevator. She just witnesses like her one friend get murdered in front of her and then she starts plunging towards the surface to basically kill all these people she's just met. She just met and she's basically having a breakdown and then like on top of that this thunderous music is happening and then like it's not just going it's not just shifting from two thirty five to like one hundred and eighty five, but shifting from two thirty five to full imax. So it's like it's crazy and they have like a good thirty seconds to do it. It's a very effective scene. I'm not necessarily like a fan of those movies, but that's scene. I remember being like that is great filmmaking, that is someone actually doing this in a really cool way, and ours is as much subtler. You know, we you know, we stretch it out. I don't think most people notice when we do it, and that was the goal. But even early on the Daniels were watching montage, is a different format and they really like the idea of how messy it was to actually like quickly cut between these different formats. And the same time they also thought it was really helpful to have a shift in format, to have to inform the audience that there what they were in a different universe. But for the most part, you know, a lot of the I think a hot dog fingers is two to one because we least we lent. We leaned towards Netflix, like Rom coms in a way. Initially we look that referencing Todd Haynes has carol, but we just thought that was a crime. We couldn't slash week slash, we couldn't do anything nearly as beautiful as what they had done. Like it was. It was like we were going for it and they're like NAS, we can't, it's not going to work. I Love Carol as a reference point for hotdog fingers, Carol, Hunger Games. And then there's you. Now I say we referenced its Carol, but no, we never fully, fully did that. We didn't yet, not didn't get close to it. So is there a scene that proved particularly difficult to get correct or one you're most proud of, or favorite universe or Ratatui reference? Whatever the hardest seem to shoot? Well, it's different. The one thing to get right was the what we call the empathy fight, where Evelyn marches up the stairs and the on top of like having a shifting lighting. That was a rhythm that we programmed into the board by hand, kind of like a beat machine. You had people on wires, you had paper floating around and then we had, so we had to get we didn't have, like we had to be very careful about how we spent money. So we got techno cranes for that, you know, these cranes that can extend the camera out. We're all really excited and it's like the only reason we have these cool devices is because we don't know how to get a camera over a water fountain or to like over stairs. So it was it was just very hard to pull off. I never thought a stairway sequence would be so painful to shoot, but it's. We spent days just trying to figure out, like how to get the camera there, how to make it elegant, how to have ten people on a staircase and put a camera in between them. That was the hardest thing to shoot. But the I think, the most most apt antic answer for that is the Rock Universe, which we shot four hours south of La at a at a location called the Anza Borreego that I had been to before and I had actually proposed to my wife there because it was so stunning, and I kept mentioning it to them as we were shooting. As a guys, we got to go back. It looks like it's a different planet there's nothing there and they're they they were like, what can't we just go shoot it in the woods? And I was like, because it's not going to be epic and we're just going to be staring at this one image for like, you know, like five minutes. And eventually I convinced them to drive down with me, and so we spent five hours driving down to a road that's not a road but just literally just a bunch of sand, and we turned off and then two of our cars got stuck and then we had then we got into one car and kept driving with fear of of that we were going...

...to get stuck, and we made it out there and they all agreed it was pretty epic. But when we ended up shooting there was like a hundred and fifteen degrees. One of our cars overheated or ran out of water. We had to do it in one day. We only gave ourselves six hours when there was a crew of five people. Like I post about it on Instagram when I can. I think I phrase it is. You know, it was really fun to do something with your friends, trying to basically make something so stupid seems so great, and that felt like the best version of that movie is really making it incredibly painful to go and shoot just two rocks somewhere in the middle of nowhere, like what kind of that? That just felt appropriate. So kind of closing out. Well, I guess one last everything everywhere question is just how long was the shoot we have? I think we're scheduled for thirty eight days. We've finished around thirty six. Because of Covid we had two days left and when we yeah, so we but then we had to know. We did, you know, a day shooting these rocks, a day or two shooting this noodle verse. That never happened, these much these much smaller paired down shoots, and then we had another two days, like foot, probably a year later, to shoot hot dog fingers, two thousand and one sequence of the monkeys and then some green screen stuff. So you know, it's probably a forty something days, but you know, but the actual shoot itself was only thirty six if I'm correct, but it was between a thirty six and forty days. And the other thing I wanted to ask is obviously you and the Daniels worked on Swiss army man and I was wondering if there's any I'm sure there's a lot. Is there any like specific thing that you took from Swiss army man that like informed everything everywhere? Swistie was really hard to make. We had ten hour days. It was a twenty three days shoot in three different cities that we had to fly to. It had wire work, underwater, work, bears, fire explosions, far harder, I think, than this movie, and I think what we found out on that is you can do a lot with very little, and so a lot of a lot of this movie out. You know, there's so many scenes that are just two seconds long. I supposed to be kind of figured out, like if we plan really hard for the stuff that we care about, we can it's there's not a great way to put it, but basically, if you really care about it, you can fight for it still get it, and that's what happened on this film. There were so many small pieces that every department would be like, I care about this, I'm going to make this great. I hot dog hands. We had no money for it. It was just going to be this cute thing and our department was like we're changing the whole set to mustard and catch up and tan and hot dog pink and we're going to add cats, like they really killed themselves on it trying to make it look amazing. And now hot dog fingers is like the main takeaway of the movie from a merchandising standpoint. Like they're on the hundred twenty four website already, as I'm sure you've seen. Yep, that was definitely the I didn't think they could be topped, but I think Racud Cooney has a dueling fan base. We'll see it. We'll see which sequel gets made. So before the Big Cahuna final question, just what are you working on now that you can talk about, I guess. Yeah, I finished a TV show called gas slit with Sean Penn Julia Roberts. That was set in the s about the Watergate scandal. That was that was really fun exciting to do with the show of trying to kind of create that look. And now I'm working on a TV show of a twenty four netflix called beef with Stevenyn and Alle Wong, kind of a mischief in mayhem set in a modern Los Angeles. Is Pretty Fun. It's pretty it's pretty unique storytelling. Awesome, Trent. Is it time for the BIG COHUNA final question? Yeah, I'd say so. So the big COONA. Final question...

...is just what's the last good or sorry? What's the last great, not good, great movie that you watched? And it can be a re watch or a new release great, not good movie. HMM, I mean, I know that I know the answer in my head. I don't. I'm trying to think that there's something more obvious, like a great, not good movie. I just rewatched blade again, like the original Wesley Snipe Swan. Yeah, I love it. I love it. Man, the movie ends. I've been saying, like some motherfuckers are always trying to I skate up hills. That's like the best. That's the best like finishing line of any of any action til I've ever seen. It's a ridiculous movie. My friend just watched it and he was like that's terrible. He had never seen it. I guess it's just because I grew up watching it. I was like, it is pure cinema. It is wonderful. The open. I keep trying to to work on a film that will let me remake the opening spring coliner, sprinkler, stink woods, when he's in a club and the reigns down blood like it's just the best worst movie and the re making it now. So I'm I'm curious that they're going to keep the blood sprinklers and not. I hope. I was just going to say they're they're going to shoot that pretty soon. Yeah, they got a lot of the buck to we'll see what happens. Trent, you want to close us out? Sure. Thanks so much to larkinsiple. He's worked on a bunch of cool movies, but most recently everywhere, every everything, everywhere all at once, which is in theaters. You should go see it. It's really good. Thanks for having to e to a Oh yeah, there you go. How was that, Trent? Was that a good interview? I really enjoyed it. It was efficient, I think he we were told we had like forty minutes and we made and you know, country girls make do. Yeah, I think I've edited this interview. It's pretty seven minutes long. WHOA tight, we made it. Yeah, and I guess we'd love to have come back on you know. Yeah, then he allude to that. He said like maybe we'll talk in a year or some you did. I don't remember if that was on air off, but he did say that. Cool. We've never had a return get. I mean we've had returned discussion guests but we've never had to return interview. Now. We've talked of those. We've had some close ones, but it's just the stars of never aligned. But there's a few we'd love to have back on maybe one day. All right. Should we wrap up? Yeah, so I guess next week we'll be discussing this film. No surprises there, and after that we're not at liberty to say what comes next. But I think we've got some some cool stuff. Do we we can, we could probably now let's save it for next week. Let's say it for next week. I want to part. Well, part, it's the end of the episode. We can come on it. Just the boys are here now. I guess that's fair. All Right, sure. We interviewed the production designer of Richard Link later's film Apollo ten and a half and is also just kind of just been Richard Link later's production designer for the past like twenty years, it seems. Yeah, he worked on a skinner darkly, he worked on Bernie, he worked on last flag flying, he worked on bad news wire song was like his first movie. Yeah, so pretty cool guy, very fun to talk to, very fun interview. I thought so that you can look forward to that in two weeks. And then after that we have some exciting stuff planned, but nothing question mark. But we do, but not stuff we're at liberty to talk about because it's not stuff that is as of yet happened. Yes, yes, okay, I'd say that's enough of that. Yeah, thanks for listening. Guys. Follow us on Instagram and twitter. Give us rate it good rating on Apple Podcast, spotify, Amazon music and Google podcasts. Whatever you're listening on, you should recommend us to a friend or your mom or your aunt, oh, your little Bra', your little brother. Tell him about the show,...

Bro please do and see you next week, guys,.

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